Does “untyped” also mean “dynamically typed” in th

Question

I'm reading a slide deck that states "JavaScript is untyped." This contradicted what I thought to be true so I started digging to try and learn more.

Every answer to Is JavaScript an untyped language? says that JavaScript is not untyped and offered examples of various forms of static, dynamic, strong, and weak typing that I'm familiar and happy with.. so that wasn't the way to go.

So I asked Brendan Eich, the creator of JavaScript, and he said:

academic types use "untyped" to mean "no static types". they are smart enough to see that values have types (duh!). context matters.

Do academically-focused computer science folks use "untyped" as a synonym of "dynamically typed" (and is this valid?) or is there something deeper to this that I am missing? I agree with Brendan that context is important but any citations of explanations would be great as my current "go to" books are not playing ball on this topic.

I want to nail this down so I can improve my understanding and because even Wikipedia doesn't refer to this alternative usage (that I can find, anyway). I don't want to mess up with either using the term or questioning the use of the term in future if I'm wrong :-)

(I've also seen a top Smalltalker say Smalltalk is "untyped" too, so it's not a one-off which is what set me off on this quest! :-))

Answer 1

I am not a computer scientist, but I would be rather surprised if "untyped" were really used as a synonym for "dynamically typed" in the CS community (at least in scientific publications) as imho those two terms describe different concepts. A dynamically typed language has a notion of types and it enforces the type constraints at runtime (you can't for example divide an integer by a string in Lisp without getting an error) while an untyped language doesn't have any notion of types at all (e.g. assembler). Even the Wikipedia article about programming languages (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Programming_language#Typed_versus_untyped_languages) makes this distinction.

Update: Maybe the confusion comes from the fact that some texts say something to the extent that "variables are not typed" in Javascript (which is true). But that doesn't automatically mean that the language is untyped (which would be false).

Answer 2

Agree with Brendan - context is everything.

My take:

I remember being confused, circa 2004, because there were arguments breaking out about whether Ruby was untyped or dynamically typed. Old school C/C++ people (of which I was one) were thinking about the compiler and saying Ruby was untyped.

Remember, in C, there are no runtime types, there are just addresses and if the code that's executing decides to treat whatever's at that address as something it isn't, whoops. That's definitely untyped and very different from dynamically typed.

In that world, "typing" is all about the compiler. C++ had "strong typing" because the compiler's checks were more stringent. Java and C were more "weakly typed" (there were even arguments about whether Java was strongly or weakly typed). Dynamic languages were, in that continuum, "untyped" because they had no compiler type checking.

Today, for practicing programmers, we're so used to dynamic languages, we obviously think of untyped to mean no compiler nor interpreter type-checking, which would be insanely hard to debug. But there was a period there where that wasn't obvious and in the more theoretical world of CS is may not even be meaningful.

In some deep sense, nothing can be untyped (or almost nothing, anyway) because you must have some intent in manipulating a value to write a meaningful algorithm. This is the world of theoretical CS, which isn't dealing with the specifics of how a compiler or interpreter is implemented for a given language. So "untyped" is (probably, I don't know) entirely meaningless in that context.

Answer 3

Untyped and dynamically typed are absolutely not synonyms. The language that is most often called "untyped" is the Lambda Calculus, which is actually a unityped language - everything is a function, so we can statically prove that the type of everything is the function. A dynamically typed language has multiple types, but does not add a way for the compiler to statically check them, forcing the compiler to insert runtime checks on variable types.

Then, JavaScript is a dynamically typed language: it is possible to write programs in JavaScript such that some variable x could be a number, or a function, or a string, or something else (and determining which one would require solving the Halting Problem or some hard mathematical problem), so you can apply x to an argument and the browser has to check at runtime that x is a function.